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 Void Topic - It Has Been Done!

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Dominator046
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PostSubject: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 8:53 am

As someone who values the effort put into SmithRP, as well as the logic and stability provided by solid metallurgy and crafting, I must come forward and express displeasure regarding the current state of the Metals of Aeria.

I do not mind fantasy metals, or new twists on logic at all; HOWEVER, changing the properties of real and factual metals can cause serious damage to the flow of RP, and the usage it and other metals present.

I can mention several things that should be changed to ensure fluent, flowing, and entertaining roleplaying that will not come to snags or twists. I will expand upon this later after an edit, but I'm pressed for time at the moment: Bronze, Iron, Steel, Titanium, Silver, and perhaps Gold..

Now, I am NOT going to dispute ANY MAGICAL TRAITS or ANY custom metals, for the fair play that fantasy has in the world; I merely wish to shed light on the realistic physical properties that they should carry. I do not mind fantasy, but proper usage of what exists in our world and has been brought to Aeria should be well honed and maintained.

As well, should this change be undesired, or inconvenient, I would consider RENAMING every metal that I've mentioned, as they do not hold true to their original counterparts. While this is not a major issue, I wish to try and help this community in any way that I feel that I can. = )

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Last edited by Dominator046 on Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:25 am; edited 2 times in total
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Pat
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 9:02 am

As far as I'm aware, Silver and Gold act like silver and gold in the real world except that they are both conductors of magic, with gold being the better, and that silver acts as anathema to dark creatures. Otherwise they melt at the same temperatures, bend at the same force, etc. Just as they would in real life.

As far as Bronze, Iron, and Steel, I'm not aware of any difference at all with their real life metals.

I think Titanium is different than it's real life counter-part by being "much heavier than steel or iron".


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Dominator046
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:07 am

Pat wrote:
As far as I'm aware, Silver and Gold act like silver and gold in the real world except that they are both conductors of magic, with gold being the better, and that silver acts as anathema to dark creatures. Otherwise they melt at the same temperatures, bend at the same force, etc. Just as they would in real life.

I agree, for the most part, this is fine. However, I have heard some people saying that their weapons are entirely silver, which would result in something very soft, and not able to hold an edge. I wanted to mention gold so that it's in the listing, and people will know its properties, if they're new to SmithRP or want to know if its different in Aeria. Also, having magical qualities like that are actually quite excellent = ) . Silver is the best conductor known, and gold is a close second, and gold can also reflect infrared light that produces heat.

Pat wrote:
As far as Bronze, Iron, and Steel, I'm not aware of any difference at all with their real life metals.

This is relieving, and if so, then that clears up some concerns. I would be more than happy to contribute material for them, to give more information and more insight unto how these metals can be used by those who wish to play smiths and or engineers; since there seems to be a lot of demand for these type of characters. Also, adding different types of Woods and Stones might be useful too, both real ones and not; even better, I'm less learned on them, so I'd be taking the contributor's word on their abilities (aside from very basic woodshop/lumber knowledge stuff). = )

In short: Bronze should probably be mentioned as softer, able to hold an edge, and very smooth and frictionless. Iron should be mentioned as being more durable and resistant to bending than steel, but is heavier, does not hold an edge as well, nor holds well against the elements when untreated.

Steel should be mentioned as a variety of metals that involve iron treated with various compounds (which could be called salts in a more traditional sense, or powders, but I'm not worried about that) that treat and change the qualities of the metal. There are as many steels as there are colors in the world, mostly, as it comprises pretty much any metal with an iron and partial carbon base. Some steels are more durable, but less sharp, some are more sharp but less durable, some lighter, some requiring less maintainance, and some keeping a nice middle ground. But, the key to making great steel, and perhaps great metal overall, is just the right amount of tempering; the skill of the smith outweighs the material most times.


Pat wrote:
I think Titanium is different than it's real life counter-part by being "much heavier than steel or iron".

This is very true, Titanium is like a real life mithril, its a very light metal for how very strong it is, but some steels can present themselves as stronger than titanium, while also providing a good deal of sharpness. Now, in all truth, in my opinion I think a name change for this metal would be beneficial if its not going to stick true to the properties of the real-world's metal; solely to eliminate confusion. I mean, I would be happy to write material for whatever metals I could, but I would honestly recommend changing the name if its an Aeria-born metal.

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Kain
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:13 am

todo list just keeps getting bigger.

well, the alloy list was huge, and we didn't get through all or even half of them. But yeah, we could give that another look and some revision, but the priority here is gonna be lower than everything else we're handling right now. The load's kinda heavy as it is.
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Dominator046
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 11:59 am

Kain wrote:
todo list just keeps getting bigger.

well, the alloy list was huge, and we didn't get through all or even half of them. But yeah, we could give that another look and some revision, but the priority here is gonna be lower than everything else we're handling right now. The load's kinda heavy as it is.

this is very understandable good sir, in fact, perhaps only putting in a list of USED alloys would be better, giving roleplayers and admins the ability to bring up stuff as the roles advance. = ) I understand this is a tall order, which is why isntead of just saying this should be done, I would be happy to help when I have time; I could write out information on alloys I'm given, as well as the base metals.

Don't feel yourself pressured to get to this, I just thought I'd do what I could to help point out additions/improvements. = )

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Kain
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 2:08 pm

I think we use just about all of them in some way or another, and honestly, we'd use more if we had more prepared. I think adding some pricing would be great, too, now that we have a market and standard prices going.
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 2:33 pm

I'd be entirely behind you, Dominator, if you wanted to write a metallurgy / working with metals page. You seem to know what you're doing, and have a decided interest in it.

Also, Gold is already on that page, in the alloys section.

Quote :

Aluminum + Brass = Gold
This unlikely compound is Aeria's primary form of currency and is exceedingly tough to create by hand. The two metals of Aluminum and Brass prove to be nigh impossible to combine, and those willing to make their own gold often have to add a third metal, making the currency counterfeit. The Gold compound is formed only under immense heat and pressure, making it a material found deep underground, or in exceedingly-expensive factories that contain the right equipment to make this compound. Gold is a lot more softer than most metals, and as such, does not make a good primary material for weapons and armour. Gold however, is VERY reactive to magic, and amplifies and holds all kind of magic, making it good trimming for armour, and also as a useful material for academic and scientific tools.

I understand that the origin of gold doesn't match the real world - if I remember correctly Gold is formed during Supernovas, at the center of super-massive stars - but we don't exactly have that, here. The World Storm is a good alternative. It's almost, if not more, ferocious and puts off a tremendous amount of energy, constantly. So maybe Gold is formed in the World Storm, as opposed to some other metals, which might form after they escape the World Storm and coalesce as a part of Aeria.

Also. The part about Silver, people with fully silver blades? That's already been addressed, in this thread.

To quote my own work,
Quote :
So-called 'Silver' Weapons are usually Steel Weapons with the edges coated in Silver. Given the rarity of the metal, pure silver weapons are the exception rather than the rule, usually existing as family heirlooms of ornamental or ceremonial nature. To use a Silver weapon against anything but dark creatures is folly; the metal has no effects against men or other races, and clashing weapons will result in the silver being chipped and damaged. The aim of anyone with a silver blade should be a single, precise thrust into a vital region, ending the battle as soon as possible. For this reason, silver weapons usually manifest as daggers, used in the offhand or used for a finishing strike.

So people hefting around silver weapons are either misinformed or they actually mean steel coated in silver.
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LawnJesus
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 2:53 pm

If you have a serious metallurgy, might I suggest this:

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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 3:39 pm

Pat wrote:
I'd be entirely behind you, Dominator, if you wanted to write a metallurgy / working with metals page. You seem to know what you're doing, and have a decided interest in it.

I'd be sure to do my homework. = ) I have a lot of that regarding my college level courses, so I need to be taking care of that first; however, if I get a document together, I'll be sure to bring it to proper attention.

---

Pat wrote:
I I understand that the origin of gold doesn't match the real world - if I remember correctly Gold is formed during Supernovas, at the center of super-massive stars - but we don't exactly have that, here. The World Storm is a good alternative. It's almost, if not more, ferocious and puts off a tremendous amount of energy, constantly. So maybe Gold is formed in the World Storm, as opposed to some other metals, which might form after they escape the World Storm and coalesce as a part of Aeria.

Sounds like a solid idea to me, for sure. = )

---

Pat wrote:
I Also. The part about Silver, people with fully silver blades? That's already been addressed,

Alright, just making sure. = P It does seem some people didn't understand it, but I wanted to make sure the lore was int he right place, which it seems like it is.

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Kain
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Fri Sep 21, 2012 3:55 pm

whoa

lore writer for the metals

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Atlas
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Sat Sep 22, 2012 8:39 am

Titanium is one of the weaker metals, its only real strength is its resistance to heat. Iron is stronger and heavier, titanium just has a shine to it bringing the misconception. Not to mention the tough sounding name.
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Sun Sep 30, 2012 6:19 am

Atlas wrote:
Titanium is one of the weaker metals, its only real strength is its resistance to heat. Iron is stronger and heavier, titanium just has a shine to it bringing the misconception. Not to mention the tough sounding name.

There are alloys of titanium (and I thought titanium in itself, I will research this to validate your point) that Titanium had a good strength to weight ratio, not being as strong as a good steel, but very, very light.

But, before I even begin work on a metallurgy page, I will look this up.

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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Sun Sep 30, 2012 6:28 am

Atlas wrote:
Titanium is one of the weaker metals, its only real strength is its resistance to heat. Iron is stronger and heavier, titanium just has a shine to it bringing the misconception. Not to mention the tough sounding name.

Just thought I'd leave this here for you.
Titanium; The strongest of the normal metals. It will break if forged improperly or for too long, so it can't be used to make weapons or armour. It can however, reinforce any other basic metal. Titanium is also much heavier than Steel and Iron.
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:21 am

according to wikipedia, it's actually harder and lighter than steel and iron. In either case, Dom, you were supposed to get started on this, weren't you?
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:45 am

I'd also like to point out that Aeria's titanium, and real life titanium are two different things. If it were real titanium it would be impossible to smelt because real titanium melts at a temperature where it would combust air.
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Sun Sep 30, 2012 2:08 pm

noodle, did you not read the thread?

o.o

the intent is to make the real-world metals more realistic so the understanding of either metal doesn't clash, and we have no reason not to.
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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:55 pm

Noodle wrote:
I'd also like to point out that Aeria's titanium, and real life titanium are two different things. If it were real titanium it would be impossible to smelt because real titanium melts at a temperature where it would combust air.

We already discussed dis. = P

Kain wrote:
according to wikipedia, it's actually harder and lighter than steel and iron. In either case, Dom, you were supposed to get started on this, weren't you?

I want to study a little more than Wikipedia, no offense, wikipedia is very helpful, but confirmation from various reliable sources is often more precise and more accurate. As well, I did not say definitely that I would be beginning this immediately; I have a great deal of school work to deal with, and in my off time, I try to enjoy the server's gameplay. = ) I would love to contribute, and Metallurgy would be the first thing on my list, but also on that list are stories, and other things; I do wish to do it, and I most likely will at some point (I've already begun some pre-emptive planning), but I can't say anything for certain yet about a 'finish date'.

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PostSubject: Re: Void Topic - It Has Been Done!   Sun Sep 30, 2012 9:51 pm

okay, but I was going by scientific statistics. Titanium's hardness, on three different scales, is above Iron's. I didn't bother to check its structure.
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